[Rspamd-Users] Is RSPAMD racist?

Daniel Armengod daniel at armengod.cat
Tue Jun 23 14:30:00 UTC 2020

 >It's a relatively simple change.

People who perpetuate this argument have clearly never touched a 
codebase of any significant complexity, or widespread adoption.

Regardless of the merit of the change, or whether one's ultimate opinion 
on the subject is to go ahead with the change or not, it's an objective 
fact that the technical (economic) cost of refactoring an entire 
codebase __and associated documentation, interfaces (internal and 
external), conventions, etc__ is NOT inconsiderable. It MUST be 
acknowledged in any serious discussion of the matter.

Anytime I see people suggesting, with varying levels of sincerity, that 
the issue begins and ends with 's/badword/goodword/g' I roll my eyes all 
the way to the ceiling. It's simply not.

A much more practicable approach is to consciously avoid using 
"problematic" terminology in new codebases, if one is so inclined. That 
is an idea I could bloody well get behind.

 >When someone yells, "Ow! You're standing on my foot!", you get off 
their foot.

I'm the kind of person who finds it hard, sometimes to my own detriment, 
to say "no" to a request. It's ingrained in me to try to be 
accommodating to other's needs, a result of my upbringing. Most of the 
time, I'm proud of this fact.

If someone yells, "Ow! You're standing on my foot!", I get off their 
foot. And apologize profusely.

If someone says "Look, there's this thousand-mile highway that, when 
viewed from thirty thousand feet and your head tilted at a 90º angle, 
kinda resembles the shape of a letter that is sometimes used as an 
insult towards a group of people I identify with. Can you tear it down 
and rebuild it anew?", I... honestly don't know what to answer. But I do 
not tear down the highway.

I wonder if in 2021 we'll be renaming all occurrences of "program crash" 
to "abnormal program termination", to avoid evoking negative feelings on 
those who have been victims of vehicular accident.

On 23/06/2020 15:56, Jered Floyd wrote:
> RSPAMD isn't racist, but it's (unintentionally, historically) using terminology that perpetuates racial bias.
> The simple answer is to move to allowlist and denylist.  It's a relatively simple change.  We should do it.  The deprecated terms can remain for compatibility.
> Please don't start in with "well actually"-ing and arguing that people are being overly sensitive, or it's not meant like that, or whatever lame conservative snowflake response you want to jump in with -- that behavior *is* actually racist.
> When someone yells, "Ow! You're standing on my foot!", you get off their foot.  You don't say, "well, actually, I'm really only on the edge of your shoe and probably only your large toe; let's have a discussion about the merits of me moving my foot."  You get off their fucking foot.
> --Jered
> ----- On Jun 22, 2020, at 11:37 PM, Rob Gunther redrob at gmail.com wrote:
>> We received our first complaint today about RSPAMD being racist.
>> Apparently using the terms whitelist & blacklist are offending people.
>> Is the industry that are currently using the terms whitelist & blacklist
>> moving to other terms? Something that people find less offensive these days?
>> I would assume these two words will soon be bad things, the industry I
>> assume will be coming up with some other terms.
>> --
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